Artists and Depression

[YL West]

I go through bouts of depression. I have my ups and downs. Not manic or anything, but certainly something I have come to understand "requires medication".

Sometimes I wonder if the medication curbs my creative side...

I know lots of artists in all different creative aspects have been chronicled with different forms of depression.

How many of you have these same issues? Do you write it off as ups and downs? Are you treated for it? Do you feel it contributes to your creativity, is a bi-product of it or has no relation?

YL

[Paul Marossy]

I have had periods of depression for as long as I can remember. Even considered suicide from time to time between 13 & 17, but after I found a faith in God almost twenty years ago, those thoughts went away. But depression has still hit me from time to time. In fact, I'm going thru "mid-life crisis" right now, and sometimes I have felt very depressed in the last couple of months. I haven't (and do not want to) taken medication for any of this, though.

I have noticed that, for myself, that if I have no outlet for all of my creativity I can get very depressed because I become something of a dead sea - all of this stuff is flowing thru me, but it has no outlet. The real Dead Sea has such a high salt content in it that you can literally float on it. And it has no outlet to the sea.

So, what I have found is that I need to have an outlet of some sort, some way to release the creativity that would otherwise be bound up inside of me. Getting some exercise, like going hiking, sometimes can do wonders all by itself. ANd having things like this network and my MySpace Music page also give me that creative outlet. And it's cool that some people even like my music. Also, trying new things can be therapeutic as well. It gets your mind focused on something new and different. Like writing lyrics or poetry if you haven't done it before, for example.

Some of my best tunes have come forth while I was in a depression. I went thru a long one about ten years ago. Some it it had to do with wanting a soulmate and a family, but it wasn't until after I died to those desires that those things came to me. So, I just had to keep fighting, to keep swinging until I got thru it. I know, it's a tough place to be, but if dealt with correctly it can be a real character builder and when you have overcome, it can also inspire and help other people to believe that there is hope for them. What kept me going thru those times was the hope (and belief) that tomorrow had better things in store for me. And it did!

[YL West]

Thanks for the responses guys!! I feel better already! LOL!! I'm not sure of depression's effect on improvising, specifically, but it certainly has a corrolation creatively. I too have contemplated suicide, and although it is really no joke, the person who really got me to stop thinking about it said "shut up and do it already!! I'm sick of your empty threats...it makes me not want to talk to you anymore..."

Activities you enjoy are the key to breaking the cycle. Hang out with friends, go on a walk, listen to something uplifting. Remember the stamp you want to leave on the earth. Paul's right that things like this site and MySpace help you to reach out and not feel as threatened as you may in a face to face situation.

Many of the songs from my upcoming CD are from a period of great depression or deal with healing or recognition of a bad path. Someday is a tune I wrote about not feeling like I could ever live up to my dad and what I supposed his expectations of me were. Walking Away is about leaving a few things behind...some relationships...some substances...some stereotypes of life. 4th Grade is a reflection on my best and worst times in life (at the time I wrote it). The title track, With Sunrise Behind Me, may seem a bit pessimistic, but is actually my realization that I need to get up and get going so I can accomplish what I want to in life...Time is ticking!!!

When I was over-medicated, I lost my creative side. So its a fine line. I guess I'll take the bad (depression) because I desire to make the good (music).

"If you don't live it, it can't come out of your horn."- Charlie Parker

[Paul Marossy]

Honestly, sometimes the only thing that got me thru to the next day was the belief that tomorrow would be better than today was. I never lost hope, and now I can say that I am a blessed man because I perservered and didn't take the easy road (like suicide). It was tough, but looking back, I am happy that I didn't do anything drastic like that.

I agree, it is a fine line. That's what can make life interesting and what comes out of that can be beautiful and inspiring to other people, in the end.

[Mike McCardle (aka Mojotron)]

Depression is a difficult thing to combat - for a lot of people there is no way to make it go away; and that is completely normal and very common. I have found that what I have had to keep a close eye on is the level of despair/disappointment that I am feeling. When I notice that I'm starting to feel down - I focus more on God: And, for me fellowship and prayer are the best remedy. But, a lot of times when I am down - I am the least willing to do the things that I should - which makes it worse. God has put a lot of patient people in my life.

The 'half over' thoughts are a bit of a different deal IMO; I know the 'half over' thoughts well – this gets pretty deep.

To me, the 'half over' thoughts are more 'disappointment' than despair - but it sure gets muddy. My thoughts about life turned from focusing on the possibilities (when I was in my late 30's); and as I got to 40+ my thoughts have often focused on the things I will never have time/opportunity to do.

When I started getting close to 40 I started doing a lot of praying and studying about why all of a sudden I was sort of fixated on ‘the meaning of life’… as if I had never contemplated it before, which I had often. Eventually I got this sorted out from the Bible - not really getting these ideas from other people - not a church – just working out my relationship with God.

I have resolved this for myself by making the observation that I think that God has designed creation to begin the process of evolving to a state full of despair (hopelessness) and disorder (death) any time that creation chooses to lose sight of God’s place in the universe (from Romans 1 and Philippians 4:10-11). So, if I believe in the God of the Bible - and the Bible does not have a 'partial belief' option – then I have to accept that He is in control of all things, knows all things, is everywhere, eternal and is working for the good of those that choose to follow Him 100% of the time (Romans 8). From 1 Corinthians 2:9 - "No eye has seen, no ear has heard, no mind has conceived what God has prepared for those who love him" : And, that is what gives me true hope.

So, not all disappointment is avoidable, but I think all disappointment comes from the difference between my expectations and the will of God for my life. The path to being in, and doing, God’s will is through a growing faith in God and living through the strength of His Spirit and not through my own strength. From that comes the fruit of the Spirit in a person’s soul/life (peace, patience, kindness, hope love…). I think that despair comes from the deterioration of a person’s hope, the hope of man is that somehow there is meaning to life and that life does not follow the path of what we can see - and end; rather hope comes from faith that life follows the path of what we believe in - and is eternal.

Of course, once a trip to Del Taco led to a great deal of despair/disappointment too, however...

I guess it’s similar/simpler to say that peace is tough to find when the reality of life is that we see everything we care about, our talents, fall apart and die throughout our whole lives. The realization of this, IMO, all starts with that first ice-cream cone that falls in to the dirt, but is really driven home when you hit 40.

The first part (chapters 1-8) of the book of Romans in the Bible is an interesting, intelligent, study (albeit from a Jewish perspective) of this by recognizing that man’s efforts to get and hold ‘things’ – results in despair/disorder because man needs to seek God alone and He will bring the things that are right to a man who asks – true peace, hope, love, freedom all come only from a relationship with God... Part of this process in every person’s life is the ‘half over’ realization; you have to touch the fire to know how real it is… kind of thing.

I think, specifically for men, that we are all (unless a person is like Gandhi…) culturally programmed to see our worth in what we do, what we contribute, what we have achieved and what we hold; but when we hit 40 we start to realize that our own mortality is taking away the things we are holding on to – especially our youth and time to fulfill our dreams – and we are reminded that placing our faith in anything other than an eternal God results in despair/disorder. But, I feel that God used this disappointment to emphasize to us that we need to let go of the lost opportunities, be thankful for what I have, and to focus on what He has planned for our time here.

I'm a poor disciple of my own words here; but when I let go of all of my losses, I get to a point where I can accept who I have become and can, then, focus on what God's plan is for me on this day; as well as appreciating all of the wonderful things that are part of my life. I no longer pray for the opportunities for fulfillment, I now pray for the faith to be fulfilled.

[Paul Marossy]

Since I am also a man of faith, and maybe around the same age as you, I can relate exactly to what you are saying. And I must add that I think you put that across very well.

These days, I am just taking things one day at a time and I am thankful for each new day I get to live what really is a fascinating and wonderful life. I really have had some amazing things happen over the years, have met a lot of interesting people along the way and have even got to play with a Grammy Award winning artist once - and didn't even know it until after the fact! That person was Georgian Banov, the founder of Bulgaria's first official rock band and the co-producer of Bullfrogs and Butterflies, to which he also contributed two songs. I didn't know all the details until a few years after the second I played with him.

Anyhow, it's my perception of life that gets in the way, and often is not really reality. It's good to get a reality check once in a while.

[SkidMarkJohnson]

Back to the original question, "Do you feel it (depression) contributes to your creativity, is a bi-product of it or has no relation?

I feel that as creative people, depression is an aspect of our personality that gets projected in an outward expression of our creative talent. It's not positive or negative, it just is. I'm not talking now about mind numbed, clinical, can no longer function in society depression. I'm talking the "I'm intensely miserable, dissatisfied and my brain hurts." kind of depression that we all go through at different times in our lives, some for a day, and some for years.

As I've gotten older I've come to realize the sometimes unpleasant truth that pain and unhappiness are a completely necessary part of life. Since I have children I can see that when I make things too comfortable and never allow them to suffer the consequences of their immature actions they don't grow. I love them too much to allow them to grow in weakness. God loves us more than we love ourselves.

"No eye has seen, no ear has heard, no mind has conceived what God has prepared for those who love him"

Bringing all that back to music I believe there has to be some pain and dissatisfaction involved in attaining a higher degree of musicianship otherwise we'd all be playing those little plastic guitars with the wind-up crank on the side or for those born after 1985, Rock Star 2!

[Mike McCardle (aka Mojotron)]

So, you have a problem with wind-up guitars? :)

I think being a musician is a lifelong study in pain and dissatisfaction.

What you say is very true - my older kids are a lot less disciplined than my younger ones - and I wish I had done things a little differently when I was a younger parent.

[Paul Marossy]

Wow, Tim, it sounds like you are fortunate to still be alive after that!

[SkidMarkJohnson]

Tim, the dramatic stories of your misfortune add fuel to my belief that our musical output is shaped as much by our abilities as it is by our inabilities. Your music and your triumph over misfortune is an inspiration!

[Paul Marossy]

Adversity can shape our lifes in a positive way, if we choose to do something positive in spite of the bad things that happen to us.

I am reminded of the great guitarist Phil Keaggy, who lost the middle finger on his right hand as a young man. He could have used that as an excuse to never try, but instead, he worked around it and the rest is history. Also, Django Rheinhardt comes to mind. Look at how many guitarists he has influenced with only really two useable fingers on his left hand. Lots of other examples.

We can either accept the challenges that life throws our way, or we can let it beat us down into obscurity and darkness. I choose to accept them and try to grow from them somehow. And sometimes, it's years afterwards when I realize what I learned from them. Sometimes, it's just a simple matter of getting thru this day to the next!